DM8000 - can't flash - too much data (or bad sectors)

Discussion in 'Hardware troubles and Repair support.' started by jumperger, May 5, 2019.

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  1. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    image.jpg
    I've got my new Tester,
    here's the reading of the 22uF cap C109.
    Is it possible to test the ICE 2A765P2 with this tester?
     
    jumperger, May 21, 2019
    #41
  2. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    Johnny B., May 22, 2019
    #42
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  3. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    And here are the results of the ICE jury:

    measurment A
    - on heat plate:
    my value - your value
    Drain - None - None
    Isense - None - None
    GND - GND - GND
    VCC - 4,45 - 6,40 MOhm
    SoftS - 74,9 - 82,3 KOhm
    FB - 30,6 - 31,03 KOhm

    measurment B
    + on heat plate:
    my value - your value
    Drain - 5,42 - 7,60 MOhm
    Isense - 2,52 - 3,36 MOhm
    GND - GND - GND
    VCC - 2,10 - 2,679 MOhm
    SoftS - 35,00 - 81,4 KOhm
    FB - 28,50 - 31,01 KOhm

    on A
    VCC 30% difference
    SoftS 10% diff

    on B
    Drain 30% diff
    Isense 25% diff
    SoftS 50% diff

    What fo you think of these measurements?
    IC was desoldered for measurement
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2019
    jumperger, May 22, 2019
    #43
  4. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    Hi guys, above you have the resistance measurements from the desoldered IC 101,

    I now measured the voltages on the 14pin connector with the PSU outside the Box.

    3.3 V on pin 4 comes from an old ATX PSU .
    There's no ballast on the Dream PSU.

    ALL voltages are fine, even the pin 12 and 13 have 2.51V

    This makes sense as my second working PSU could not help to boot my DM8000.
    This makes me think that the fault is on the Mainboard, something is droping my 2,5V down?

    PSU out of the Dream I get these voltages on 14 pin connector:
    1 - 14,65 V
    3 - 6,77 V
    6 - 12,03 V
    8 - 5,1 V
    10 - 3,36 V
    12 - 2,51 V
    13 - 2,51 V
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2019
    jumperger, May 22, 2019
    #44
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  5. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    Indeed, the vcc pin Mohm value is a bit different, but the psu should work with it, but may become unstable when there is a Amp peak, I would eventually replace it for a fresh one.

    pin 12 and 13 have 2.51V, but not when connected to the motherboard....
    It could be due the motherboard, as for the 2.5v pin 13, it could be disabled on the motherboard by removing the 3 inductors, L1102/03/04.
    The 2.5v pin 12 can on the board disabled by removing the 3 inductors, L302/05/06.
    See if the 2.5v not collapse when you disable one of the circuits.
    You can also just disable one of the wires to see which side it is, or measure these pins by ohm.
    pin 13 has 5.xxM and rising up, and goes first to the U1107 area, pin 12 has 1680 ohms and it's mainly for the cpu.
     
    Johnny B., May 22, 2019
    #45
  6. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    Where do you buy the IC , I'm located near Germany.
    Found it for 5€, but shipping is 8€, do you know some other parts which usualy are good to be replaced ? I will put everything into one order.
     
    jumperger, May 22, 2019
    #46
  7. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    It depends how fast you want it to be delivered, for example on Ebay.com searching to ICE2A765P2 you can find them cheap with Free International Shipping, but I think it may take a long time before you received it.
    Better, and faster is to search on ebay for it and find a seller in your own country.

    Nevertheless, before spending money, I would first check the 2.5v, and to find out why i' collapse.
     
    Johnny B., May 23, 2019
    #47
  8. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    This is weird:
    I unplugged pin 12 and got 2.51V when connected to the mainboard -> happy Thought I had found the error
    plugged 12 back in
    unplugged pin 13 and also got 2.51V when connected to the mainboard -> perhaps not so easy
    plugged both in 12 and 13 and still had the 2.51V when connected to the mainboard.
    Put all back together in the housing of DM8000 everything OK all voltages are there.
    Started a new flashing -> still same error too much Data or too much bad sectors.

    I think the desoldering and resoldering of the IC brought the 2.5V back, but I'm still stuck with the box.

    Next step new Flash-chip ?
     
    jumperger, May 23, 2019
    #48
  9. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    You could check the 3.3v delivery at the nand flash chip, but I think it's just fine and thus what's left is indeed the nand flash chip replacement.
     
    Johnny B., May 23, 2019
    #49
  10. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    Hi Johnny and ToySoft,

    today I got some delivery from China :) , the NAND Chips arrived.

    It's time now to replace the NAND-Flash Chip of my DM8000, I'm a little bit exited and affraid about it.

    Do you have some good hints for me doing this? Like best temperatur, a good video tutorial or ...

    I've never done that before, just some resistor and capacitor replacements.

    I have a soldering station with a classic iron and a hot air "gun" called ZD-912 like THIS ONE

    Thanks for your help.
     
    jumperger, Jun 27, 2019
    #50
  11. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    I do it always with a hot air station, and a vacuum tweezer.
    But I think, see YouTube searching something as tsop48 repair may point you to the right direction.

    Most importantly, do not force the removal of the chip, only heat the two sides of the chip, do it the left and right side and lift one side, then the other side.
    Let the heat do the work, it will release when the solder is properly heated.
    Also, do not stay on one place with the hot air, otherwise you risk to burn/damage the pcb.

    Placing the new one can simply be done on the old solder.
     
    Johnny B., Jun 28, 2019
    #51
  12. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    So the new Nand Chip is in my DM8000

    Snap1.jpg

    Snap2.jpg

    Snap3.jpg
     
    jumperger, Jun 30, 2019
    #52
  13. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    Looks to me good placed and good enough soldered but when the new nand flash chip is empty, then it may logic that you get this error.
    However, normally I would think by this issue the sim card.
    But the main question is, can you now upload a new image file to the chip when you using dreamup in serial and network mode.

    Btway, I have edit your post due the pictures because the images links to i-have-a-dreambox.com only shows when you logged in.
     
    Johnny B., Jun 30, 2019
    #53
  14. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    Thanks,
    serial Connection and network connection brought it half to life.
    DreamUp loaded a sort of flash-loader and then it got an IP and I could flash, but flashing stoped:
    To much Data, see picture
    Snap1.jpg
    sorry for the ihad link, but the upload file button brings an error.
     
    jumperger, Jun 30, 2019
    #54
  15. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    With the previous nand chip you say you had,
    too much data (or bad sectors) in partition 3 (end: 10000000, pos: 10000000)
    And now with the new one it is basically the same, but now partition 1
    too much data (or bad sectors) in partition 1 (end: 10000000, pos: 10000000)
    Uhhh I think, this issue may arise when the security sim card failed, but tomorrow I am able to try to create this problem with my motherboard, then maybe I can take you in the right direction.

    However, keep in mind that I only test, and flash these dreamboxes with a windows Xp system and a real comport.
    Newer systems, and also usb to serial cables may create these kind of issues.

    As for the upload failure on this forum I have no clue, by me it just works flawless, maybe caused to a script blocker or other blocker you use to this forum causes it.
     
    Johnny B., Jun 30, 2019
    #55
  16. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    I have real com-port, my PC is from 2007 I think, it was running Vista till march 2019, now I have Win10.
    I could give it a try with a win98 laptop, I think I tried this also before replacing the Nand.

    A problem with the Sim , shouldn’t it bring a specific error in the display?

    Previously when flashing with the browser, it went to +/- 60%, now it stucks immediately when it trys to install from memory.

    Is there a way to test if my soldering is ok, or a way to find shorts?
    I hope my iron wasn’t to hot and burned the chip or components arround.
     
    jumperger, Jun 30, 2019
    #56
  17. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    When the sim has issues, thus not working it may give some issues while flashing the chip, it needs a working sim card for a working results.
    But tomorrow I will do a test with a broken sim and trying to flash a new nand chip to see if it gives a same issue.
    However, as I said earlier, for these old receivers I always use a windows xp system to fix these boxes with dreamup.
    As for dreamup I always use both, thus serial and network connected.

    And yes, there is a way to measure the connected nand flash chip pins by ohms.
    As this nand flash chip measurements of a dm800hd shows.
    Just place the black probe to a ground spot, and measure with the other probe the pins.
    Most important are the eight I/O pins which all must be in a same range, not precisely, but close.

    And no, soldering the chip does normally not damage the nand chip, even with a hot air gun.
    Only when you have it done so hot that even the pcb becomes burned by it, then you probably also damage the nand flash chip.
     
    Johnny B., Jun 30, 2019
    #57
  18. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    Could you confirm that the I/O side is the side with C902 ?
    on C902 , is there a GND SIDE? If yes is GND near to C or 2 ?

    I did the dreamUp flashing with Win98 laptop, No difference.
    Also used the browser flashing methode with old Internetexplorer on Win98 Laptop, No difference

    Checked the Device Info with Browser, here it is:
    device_Info.JPG
    as you see Flash is only 64MB, thats not very much, I think my soldering went wrong?
    What does your motherboard say in device Info, with good and broken SIM?
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
    jumperger, Jul 1, 2019
    #58
  19. Johnny B.

    Johnny B. Technical Support Staff Member Moderator

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    Yes that's to low,

    Dm8000hd-info.jpg

    Probably a issue with the one of the I/O, hopefully a bad solder to/from the nand flash chip.
    Measure the I/O pins by ohm to see which one, or more has a issue.
    See this measurements overview for more info, click on the picture to see it full size.

    Dm8000hd-nand-flash-chip-pinouts-etc.jpg

    An bad solder connection with one of the 1 to 4 I/O pins will give a lower Mb size.
    An bad solder connection with one of the 5 to 8 I/O pins will give a Error on the display.

    That is why it is very important to measure these pins very precisely, measure them from the chip pins as also the motherboard.
    The value must be the same, even a slight difference can mean that the pin makes poor contact.
     
    Johnny B., Jul 1, 2019
    #59
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  20. jumperger

    jumperger Member

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    Thank you very much for your great help!!!!
    I suppose that the measurements are made with the chip on board.

    But to which pin should I make the measurement?
    C902 ? left (near C902) or right pin (near C902)?
    Or is there a more easily accessible testing point?

    our boxes are produced the same week, so they must be equal
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
    jumperger, Jul 1, 2019
    #60
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